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Halrloprillalar

You can call me Hal.

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Draco, Draconis
hal
prillalar

I'm having one of these moments where I can't decide whether to post my thoughts here for discussion or to hug them close, to use in a fic later. If you see this, you'll know I've decided to post rather than hug.

I've been re-reading OotP. I've just read the scene where Umbridge and the Inquisitorial Squad (no one expects the Hogwarts Inquisition) catch Harry et alia in her office. I was struck by just how supremely awful Draco is here.

Umbridge threatens Harry with torture: Malfoy was watching her with a hungry expression on his face.

Hermione talks about the alleged weapon they've been making: [Umbridge's] bulging eyes resting for a moment on Malfoy, who was too slow to disguise the look of eagerness and greed that had appeared on his face.

Umbridge makes a remark about Hogwarts soon being a Weasely-free zone: Malfoy laughed loudly and sycophantically.

So, he's a bastard, obviously. But I'm most interested in what motivates him. It seems pretty clear that he's interested in power. And that he's a suck-up. But is the sucking up a means to an end or is Draco more comfortable with being number two?

He's the leader of his own little Slytherin group. But he sucks up to Umbridge. Does he suck up to Snape at all? Some, IIRC.

When Harry and Ron have taken the polyjuice, they find out that Malfoy has no idea who the Heir of Slytherin is. "I wish I knew who it is," said Malfoy petulantly. "I could help them."

Sometimes I think that while Draco will take the lead when necessary, he'd rather be the sidekick. If he and Harry had hit it off in the beginning, he'd be Harry's sidekick. A sidekick to be reckoned with, but a sidekick nonetheless.

Other times, I think that Draco only sucks up to manoeuvre himself into a better position and that he's biding his time to seize power for himself.

And the rest of the time, I think that Draco and Ron should fuck.

You?


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Draco as a member of Umbridge's brigade made me want to throttle him. But the truth is he does suck up, because he's got a unique talent to recognize power and influence and he wants to be close to it. That's, of course, why he wants to be close to Harry, and also why he resents Harry so much -- to Draco's mind, Harry's achieved fame and power without any of the traditional prerequisites (most notably, being from pureblood lineage).

Draco doesn't suck up to Snape, at least, not any more than any run of the mill Slytherin, because the truth is Snape doesn't *have* any real power -- I mean, to Draco, Snape's just the guy who got passed over for the DaDa job time and again. Draco'd want to suck up to Dumbledore, but I get the feeling his father drummed it into him that Dumbledore's power is ephemeral and Draco shouldn't hitch his wagon to that star.

So when Umbridge arrives, Draco sees it as the opportunity to align himself with the first example of real power he's seen at Hogwarts. At least, the first example since Harry Potter.

That's also what makes the Draco/Ron relationship so interesting -- they're both defined in terms of Harry, neither WANTS to be defined in terms of Harry, and they both want/expect the complete opposite from Harry. But then, when it comes to rumors spreading about Harry loving the limelight, Draco and Ron are among the first to get pissed off by the idea of Harry in power.

As for what his motives are -- I think he wants to be Lucius, and Lucius got where HE was by sucking up to Voldemort. Draco's seen what kind of privilege is given to loyal minions of powerful individuals, so he's mimicking his dad -- but I also think Draco believes he can surpass his dad down the road, and gain real power from himself.

So to make a short story long, I agree with you that he is biding his time...the question is, what sort of power does Draco want? Once he passes his father, then what?

And by the way, I still plan on hugging these ideas close to use in *my* fic (the Lucius stuff, anyway), as you know, so we should chat some more about this -- maybe this week?

I don't have any free nights this week til the weekend. But I should be able to get back to you in email before that.

That's also what makes the Draco/Ron relationship so interesting -- they're both defined in terms of Harry, neither WANTS to be defined in terms of Harry, and they both want/expect the complete opposite from Harry. But then, when it comes to rumors spreading about Harry loving the limelight, Draco and Ron are among the first to get pissed off by the idea of Harry in power.

That's a good insight. Draco and Ron -- two sides of the same coin, in a way. Maybe that's part of what makes D/R slash so transgressive. It's like they're both cheating on Harry.

I think he wants to be part of things. Harry gets to be part of the action just because he's Harry. Draco wants to be important, too. He wants to be influential and he wants to be noticed. Who doesn't?

And the rest of the time, I think that Draco and Ron should fuck.

You?


I second that.

blue


But I'm most interested in what motivates him. It seems pretty clear that he's interested in power. And that he's a suck-up.

I think Draco what motivates him most is his need for his father's approval. Sure, he likes power. But only because his father is powerful, and Lucius would be proud if Draco gets some power of his own. He wanted to friend Harry, because it would a) make him feel powerful and important to have a famous friend and b) his father would approve.(though for slightly different reasons)
I don't believe Malfoy is evil. I don't think he really knows what's going on, he doesn't know how much his father is involved with Voldemort. Or maybe he knows, but he doesn't know the consequences this will have. All he wants is his father to be truly proud of him. And when Daddy says. "Suck up to Umbridge, it'll be good for you", then Draco will suck up do Umbridge. And if Lucius says, kiss Harry's feet, he will kiss Harry's feet.
Needless to say, I am not a big fan of Draco. He doesn't have own ideas, and all his attempts to get his father approval have been pretty pathetique. Quidditch didn't work out, the thing with the dragon didn't work, and now he is being Umbridges' little boy toy, and he doesn't even notice.
Ask yourself, why he - even though he is good-looking and intelligent - has no more than two true friends: Crabbe and Goyle. The way I see it, all the other Slytherins are not his friends: they either are afraid of the Malfoy family and prefer to be on good terms with them, or they want a part of his father's money or his father's power. No one wants Draco himself. Not even Draco.

I think Draco what motivates him most is his need for his father's approval. Sure, he likes power. But only because his father is powerful, and Lucius would be proud if Draco gets some power of his own. He wanted to friend Harry, because it would a) make him feel powerful and important to have a famous friend and b) his father would approve.

Interesting. I wish we knew more about their relationship -- Lucius and Draco. It's hard to extrapolate from what's in the books.

I wonder if Lucius would be proud if Draco got some real power of his own or if he'd feel threatened. It will be interesting to see how Draco develops now that Lucius is in Azkaban.

Well, it's just the feeling that I got fromt he books, though you are right, they don't tell us all that much about Draco's relationship to his father. I am not sure if Lucius will ever be proud of anything Draco does. I think he probably takes it for granted, because it is to be expected that a Malfoy becomes someone powerful. So either Draco stays that way, and maybe finally succeeds in becoming someone powerful by himself, or he finds out that he will never be good enough for his father.
Which is far more interesting, because then he will have to think for himself. Which could lead to either killing or fucking Harry. Or maybe killing Harry and fucking Ron, which would be fine with me too. Though I doubt that Jk Rowling will write about that...
Actually I think that Draco will become more important in the next books, I just don't know which direction his involvement will take. He has a lot of potential, and I don't think she will just abandon such a character. And his relationship with his father needs to be explored a lot more. Oh, it's been far too long since I've read HP slash, I think I'll have to do that right now. :-)

And the rest of the time, I think that Draco and Ron should fuck.

You?


I totally think they should. It would be grand.

I think what motivates Draco, and what he desires, is changing. When we saw him interacting with Lucius in the earlier books, and when he spoke of his father then, it seemed clear to me that Lucius brought Draco up to be a follower. He never seemed to instruct his son in any of the nitty-gritty schemes or in any techniques of real power or to trust Draco at all. So we have a boy who's been spoiled rotten and told he's better than everyone else but not given anything to back that assertion up besides his birth. At that point he responds to power as a follower, hence his attempt to hitch his wagon to Harry's star.

But it's been a few years. He's been away from his family in a hostile place where the ultimate authority is someone he's probably been told is a fool and an enemy; where the immediate authority (Snape) is clearly unable to shelter or promote his House outside of Potions class itself, and is conspired against to prevent him gaining any further influence (like the Defense job); where he's constantly being bested by this boy who rejected him; where those who agree that his birth is significant (his yearmates) are very limited in number and power.

I think being constantly thwarted and, perhaps, beginning to understand in a fuzzy way just how poorly his father has served him in terms of real preparation and support has started to tell on Draco. I think he's begun to look around for some genuine power for himself. Still, of course, on Lucius' general model. If Harry had taken him at the start, I think Draco would have been content to be the sidekick. I also think that is starting to be not the case any longer. And I think Lucius and Dumbledore had both better watch out, because if Draco does find some power he's going to be the proverbial unpredictable amateur with a deadly weapon. No discipline, lots of anger.

His motive now is a desire to strike back. At everyone.

Re: More dropping in

You are smart! Perhaps Draco will now finally be a force to be reckoned with.

His motive now is a desire to strike back. At everyone.

*writes down on a sticky note*

*blushes*

Always glad to contribute to the cause. I do hope JKR makes something interesting of Draco, but she keeps saying things about the fans liking him too much which does not bode well. The Slytherins get the short end of the stick even from the author.

But that's what fic is for.

Well, Draco is a boy who's been bullied by his father -- whether it's emotional, physical, or both is up to interpretation. My guess would be both. So on the one hand he's been raised to believe he's better than anyone else, and yet on the other hand he's got a father who tells him he's not worth anything.

Ron is the youngest of six brothers, including two older brothers who play practical jokes on him, one older brother who's turned his back on the family and obviously considers Ron hopelessly doomed, and two older brothers who are no longer around but are successful in his parents' eyes. Ron wants to be something other than the little brother.

Both of them have in front of them an example of a natural talent -- which is what Harry appears to be. How much of that talent comes from his contact with Voldemort in infancy is unclear. What they see is not the boy who doesn't belong to the Dursleys but they have to live with, but a boy who's a top-level student, a great Quidditch player, wealthy, and Dumbledore and McGonagall's favorite.

More than that, Draco didn't manage to make friends with this particular talented boy, and Ron did. So every kudo Harry gets is doubly irritating. I suspect that the Malfoys aren't fans of Dumbledore, so no matter how good Draco is, he wouldn't be one of Dumbledore's pets. And, as said in another post, Harry isn't even a pureblood, which makes it all the more unfair, doesn't it? (Of course, life isn't fair. But kids of that age are very very hipped on 'fairness'.)

Where Ron is concerned... Well, Ron is Harry's friend, and there a certain cachet in being Harry's best friend. Or one of them at least. This doesn't mean he doesn't envy Harry. You'd have to be a saint not to be occasionally jealous of a friend whose smarter, richer, more attractive, or better at something than you are. What I think keeps Ron from being completely hostile --aside from the fact that he likes Harry-- is that he knows how awful Harry's home life is. He has something Harry doesn't: a family who loves him.

Draco, at present -- well, I agree that he hasn't really progressed beyond follower; the sort of petty little things like sneaking around to catch people doing things they aren't supposed to be doing, making up nasty little songs to irritate people, and enjoying his enemies' downfall at the hands of power. I don't know if he's stepped beyond that in Book 5. As pointed out, Crabbe and Goyle aren't much of a following, and Draco doesn't seem to stand high among the other Slytherins. So I'm not sure whether he's progressed to a point where he can make a conscious choice to evil, whether he has the imagination to conceive of an evil on his own or if he's simply one of those shaven-head kids with the tattoos who make up the cannon fodder of the bad guys.

It's possible that Draco is simply JKR's image for the banality of evil, although there are times that a cigar is just a cigar. In most school stories, there is one student who hates the hero/ine for no good reason we can see. In some, the bully is routed at the end, and in some, the bully is converted at last by the hero/ine's noble nature. (No barfing on the keyboard, please. I'm only quoting from extant books.)

Which I suppose in the end says only that you could view it either way. Treat him as someone who goes along with the winning crowd, or as someone with an agenda of his.

You could even do a version where Draco turns on his father and helps defeat him. Make him into a tragic figure who recognizes his own errors and overcomes them... Sorry. Been reading too much Tolkien lately.

So I'm not sure whether he's progressed to a point where he can make a conscious choice to evil, whether he has the imagination to conceive of an evil on his own or if he's simply one of those shaven-head kids with the tattoos who make up the cannon fodder of the bad guys.

I think that's really the crux. The situation has moved far, far beyond where a school bully could have any meaningful effect. Draco's either got to rise to the occasion or be left back.

I think he'll rise. When he threatened Harry, I finally felt like he was truly invested. And without his father, maybe he'll blossom.

Sometimes I think that while Draco will take the lead when necessary, he'd rather be the sidekick. If he and Harry had hit it off in the beginning, he'd be Harry's sidekick. A sidekick to be reckoned with, but a sidekick nonetheless.

I think this is quite possibly true. I wonder if Draco realizes that: the only reason he's a force of his own in Slytherin is because Harry wasn't sorted into the same house. Any other power he has comes from his father's money and influence, or from Crabbe and Goyle's muscle.

Draco interests me in the way most bullying, nasty children in literature do: I wonder how he got that way, especially since he's been like that (as far as Harry knows) from at least age eleven.

With Dudley, the other bully in Harry's life, we see how he got that way: he was spoiled rotten, given everything he wanted, and approval, rather than discipline, from his parents for treating Harry like crap. I suspect things weren't that different for Draco. He's more clever than Dudley, and is slightly built so he has Crabbe and Goyle for any physical bullying, but I think there are definite similarities.

Of course, the books are also told (with the exception of the beginnings of the first and fourth books) almost exclusively from Harry's POV. And thus far he has a fairly poor record for interpreting people's actions correctly--Dumbledore always steps in at the end and tells what was going on. I don't think it's entirely impossible that JKR might have something up her sleeve for Draco, whether it be a joining of forces with Our Heroes, or a complete throwing in with the Forces of Evil.

I'm especially interested to see what he'll be like with Lucius publicly exposed. His power so far in the school has been almost entirely resting on his father's power outside the school, and with that gone, will he become a force of his own, or will he find someone else to suck up to? Will he make good on his threat to try and kill Harry, or was that empty posturing?

Oh, I forgot to add: I think another parallel to Draco is Sirius (and I suppose, by that token, Andromeda Black). He was from a very similar background, yet managed to escape it to become his own person. I wonder what the differences were, or was it a whole bunch of things: personality, intelligence, siblings or lack thereof.... *g*

With Dudley, the other bully in Harry's life, we see how he got that way: he was spoiled rotten, given everything he wanted, and approval, rather than discipline, from his parents for treating Harry like crap. I suspect things weren't that different for Draco. He's more clever than Dudley, and is slightly built so he has Crabbe and Goyle for any physical bullying, but I think there are definite similarities.

I've often thought about this. I think it's significant -- since physical appearance seems to be tied to personality in HP -- that they are also both blond. As are Petunia and Narcissa. As are Vernon and Lucius. (I'm extrapolating on Vernon from this: Dudley looked a lot like Uncle Vernon. He had a large pink face, not much neck, small, watery blue eyes, and thick blond hair that lay smoothly on his thick, fat head.)

I think this summer will see some big changes in Draco. I'd rather he was more definitely evil than good, but so long as there's something, I'll be happy.

And I find your Sirius comparison quite intriguing! Must think more on that.

I get the feeling JKR isn't wild about blondes! *g*

I'm intrigued by the whole Malfoy/Black connection... I think it's interesting that Sirius's brother did become a Death Eater, but didn't end up having the stomach for it, while Bellatrix is obviously in her element.

Of course, the biggest difference is probably this: Sirius is so not a follower--even in school, it's him and James together, not him following James. I wouldn't be surprised if he initially went against his family ways just to be contrary and different!

I think I'd rather Draco turn out more evil, too, but I'm still sticking on the Sorting Hat's song about the houses standing together. Something's gonna happen relating to that, I just know it.

Mind if I jump in here? I'm kind of obsessed with this subject and can't not comment on it.:-)

Draco and Dudley are similar in that they're both blond and Harry is reminded of Dudley when Draco says he's going to bully his father into getting him a broom, but I think they're fundamentally more different than the same. Dudley is blond, but he is also fat--fat because he has been overindulged. He's lazy, he complains when he only gets X amount of presents, he's a glutton, his parents talk about him like he can do no wrong. He makes fools of his parents as well. Iow, Dudley has power because he is big but he's also soft.

Draco, by contrast, is primarily described as pinched, pale and thin. He gets sweets, but passes them around. He rarely gets presents (doesn't get the broom first year, doesn't get anything in B&B the second year). In his one scene with his father he's criticized throughout the whole thing--Lucius practically calls him good-for-nothing. Lucius does buy the brooms for the Slytherin team, but I find it hard to believe he literally bought Draco a spot because he's so immune to Draco's demands in the shop. I don't really believe any of Draco's tales of being adored at home--he seems completely left out of most things involving his parents.

So for me, Dudley's the glutton but Draco is forever hungry, never getting what he wants. Therefore, Draco's a lot meaner. When Harry beats him, he takes it; he's used to it. He looks out for himself because other people don't--he could turn out to be a real survivor. That gives him more potential whichever way he goes.

I also have a hard time imagining Draco's popularity (such as it is) having to do with Lucius. I mean, 11-year-olds really don't care if one's father knows the MoM and Lucius doesn't appear to be all that impressive anyway to anyone but Draco. I think he works hard for the friends he does have (telling jokes, coming up with plans, putting on shows). His money might might be tempting of course, but I don't get the sense being friends with him means you get a lot in return. He seems to only really be close to a few people he trusts, much like Harry, who might have people wanting to be friends because of his fame, does. What's interesting, maybe, is that he thinks his power comes from Lucius--we could be in for a change if he started seeing things differently.

So I guess...where am I going with this? To me, Draco shows the potential for plenty of positive things, even if he never lives up to it. He's got energy and passion and can be surprisingly tough. He could develop well with a better authority figure, like Snape. I think there's a reason it's hard to ignore him and I'm it's explored somehow.:-)

I think that right now Draco's content to be somewhat of a follower, as long as he still gets to be feared/respected. He's still a fairly young boy, after all, and used to looking up to and listening to his father while watching his father suck up to Voldemort.

What will be interesting is how this changes now that things are getting nastier and Draco's really shoved up against the truly horrible situation going on now. I think that Draco could very well decide that he has to have it all himself, and start orchestrating things around so that he can be the top of the pile.

Of course, it could go either way. I'm interested in how Draco's going to fare once he has to get his hands bloody, because I get the sense that while he's been raised on hate and violence and power that he's actually been sort of sheltered from the worst of it. I can't quite predict whether he'll turn his back on it or embrace it.

And the rest of the time, I think that Draco and Ron should fuck.

Oh yes. They totally should.

Of course, it could go either way. I'm interested in how Draco's going to fare once he has to get his hands bloody, because I get the sense that while he's been raised on hate and violence and power that he's actually been sort of sheltered from the worst of it. I can't quite predict whether he'll turn his back on it or embrace it.

That's a really good point. Draco's been a school bully, not a Death Eater. I wonder if he has the stomach for more. But he's probably angry enough now to try.

I do feel sorry for him, annoying bastard though he is.

This is fascinating, and I think we'll see Draco and Ron being more clearly the parallel antagonists over time. I'd babble on at length if I had anything to add except "Ron rules!"

And maybe "Ron should have more sex. With anybody. On alternate bank holidays, even Draco would be fine." ;)


I think that Draco and Ron should fuck

hear hear!

I'm not the best person to say anything, because I'm a Draco fan... A _canon_ (meaning, bratty, snotty, nasty) Draco fan, but anyway.

Draco's a suckup because:
a)he knows better than to go against people who are more powerful than him; he believes that such nobility should be left to Gryffindors. Or dumbness, as he puts it *rolls eyes, smacks him*
b)he wants to cultivate a web of allies, or at least people who are neutral towards him. He doesn't want to give anyone the chance to be his enemy.
Draco: All must adore me.
*sighs*
Whilst he is capable of taking matters in his own hands, as seen at the time he dueled Potter in CoS, he also needs support of the crowd - he always looks around whenever he lets out a snarky comment, just to make sure his Slyth fellows are laughing along - AND, he is too spoiled to be comfortable with withholding complete power over his own life. He's too used to running to Daddy with anything.
Luckily, Luc's rotting in Azkaban so Draco will now have to stand for himself. I personally think he'll do well, but I'm highly biased.
Draco: You're just smart. All who love me are.

Sorry to post so long a comment in your journal, to an old entry no less, and even more considering that I don't know you at all. If it helps any, I've just read the H/D you posted at pornish_pixies and wanted to see more of your work, which brought me to your personal LJ.

Whilst he is capable of taking matters in his own hands, as seen at the time he dueled Potter in CoS, he also needs support of the crowd - he always looks around whenever he lets out a snarky comment, just to make sure his Slyth fellows are laughing along - AND, he is too spoiled to be comfortable with withholding complete power over his own life. He's too used to running to Daddy with anything.

That's a good summary, I think. I wonder if he has self-esteem issues.

Self-esteem issues? Draco? Hell, yes.

Self-esteem issues? The boy's an attention whore. =) And I love him all the more for that.
Will try to keep to Canon, however much I adore Fanon Draco.

First off, Draco cares way too much about what his Father says/does/thinks. Contrary to our usual teenager, instead of trying to find his own identity by acting contrary to what his parents would expect, he just tries his best to fit into what Lucius wants him to be. He's the personification of the concept "Daddy's Boy".
He isn't a total and worthless wimp; else he wouldn't be a leader of Slytherins. He knows his strengths and how to use them - mainly, he makes the best of his family name & his own abilities. For instance, Snape doesn't hold every Slytherin student as high as he does Draco. The kid's got talent. But I digress.
Draco's got serious issues. He's nearly obsessed with outshining Harry in Quidditch, Herm at Magic and Ron at anything. He naggs privileges and attention whenever he can. He could hold a grudge against any Gryffindor, but no: he'll bicker with the Boy Who Lived.

The motivations behind that craving for attention could go from being neglected by his parents to a natural need to be the centre of everyone's attention - in that case, I'm just so sure he'd be a Leo! ^^


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